You are notorious for your toughness. I read that one day you punished one of your men by tying him to tank tracks and crushing him.
Someone from CNN asked me about the same story. It must be in a book. This is absolutely untrue. I respect human dignity and don't remember punishing anyone that way. I love my soldiers and they love me. We're willing to die for each other every day. But reporters here multiply everything, even jokes. I have heard on Al-Jazeera many times that I had died or was badly wounded. One day I just called them up to complain. Even with different ethnic groups here, I have a good reputation. No one blames me for cruelty.
A while ago, we watched the bloody uprising of Taliban prisoners, including John Walker, at the 19th century fortress, which is also your headquarters. Is that where you live now?
No, the fort is pretty much destroyed from the bombing. I live in a town called Qadibali.
During the uprising, your troops, after they finally gained control, were accused of massacring the remaining Taliban.
We have about 4,000 Taliban prisoners altogether right now. If we wanted to kill them, there would not have been any prisoners. I must tell you that the fighting started because they misused our trust, our confidence in them and our good manners. We wanted to treat them as decent human beings and welcomed their decision to give up arms. But unfortunately they misused our hospitality. They had hidden some weapons under the car and on their bodies. When finally at Qala-jengi, they exploded a bomb [they had smuggled in] and killed or wounded many of our important commanders. After the explosion, they got hold of the weapons in a certain section and started attacking, initially killing 10 to 15 guards. The fighting started this way. They killed about 45 and wounded over 200 people of ours.
At the moment, we don't have enough hospital facilities for people to treat them. Meanwhile, some Taliban were able to escape and go to surrounding villages. There were arrests. We arrested five Arabs from a home in the area. Yes, some were killed. On the final day of the uprising, 80 were hiding, not willing to come out. I sent in a mediator and they killed him, too. Finally, we took control of the place. They were mostly Arab fighters, Chinese, Uigur, Chechens, Pakistanis, a representative of Osama bin Laden and even an American citizen.
Fighting was started by them. If some were killed, it's not our fault. We didn't want to mistreat or kill them. We wanted to treat them well. But they are terrorists and they wanted to die and they didn't just want to die by themselves and took our people as well.
Right now more than 40 [Taliban] are badly injured and I have sent them to the hospital. If we wanted to kill them, we wouldn't be so willing to send them for treatment at the hospital. There are also very important ones among them, like Mullah Nuri. I'm treating them well. If I wanted to kill them, I would've done that earlier. Only a group of some 40 Taliban who were arrested in Kunduz were not able to survive the road and died on the way because of lack of doctors and medicine. We have 4,000 Taliban prisoners right now; if we wanted to kill them, there would not have been any prisoners.
Where was John Walker exactly?
He was in the basement.
The anti-Taliban victory was in no small part due to the Taliban or Pashtun tribes switching sides in the takeover of main cities. You yourself have done it in the past when you first fought with the Soviets and then against them. Why do Afghans keep switching allegiances?
This goes back to the origins of a political group or party. Once a party or a movement is formed, the leader has to take care of the people surrounding him, his supporters and their families. You have to do whatever is best for their well-being in any given moment. As for me, I have done it to get better rights for my people. In 1992, the fall of Mazar-e Sharif was the fall of the communist regime. I don't call that changing sides. I had to take into account whatever was better for the people who were with me, fighting, even dying with me. I also had to take into account what was best for their families. If you call that changing sides, fine. But I don't. I opposed the recent United Nations effort [Bonn negotiations] because the key ministries were divided unequally. The struggle of our people [Uzbeks] was ignored. Different parts of the country should be valued equally -- that's why I opposed that. I wanted justice in the negotiations.
You visited the U.S. in 1996. What did you think of New York, where this whole thing started on Sept. 11?
I had heard many stories about New York, the high-rise buildings, the cleanliness of the streets, and also how green some places were. When I came over to the States, I was amazed at how advanced everything was, especially the roads, constructions and the buildings impressed me. I told everyone about the roads when I returned to Afghanistan. When I visited the World Trade Center, they told me details about the building and also about the 1993 attack and about how people had been killed. I thought at the time how stupid it was to do something like that to such an amazing building -- trying to destroy something people had constructed. When I heard about the Sept. 11 attacks, and that the building was destroyed and people killed, I was very, very sad.
During that visit we also went to Washington and Texas. I was amazed at how developed everything was over there as well. We visited oil companies in Texas and talked to a number of people about the possibility of developing the oil in Afghanistan. This would help the country a lot.
Afghan women were among the groups to suffer the most under the Taliban. Even with the Taliban gone, women are not celebrating on the streets or rushing to take part in political structures ...
Women are half the soul of a society. My belief is to treat them as equals to men. That's why I allowed ladies to work and go to university. Education is not only for men. That's what we had in Mazar-e Sharif in the past and that's what we'll have in the future. I have already announced that women who used to work in offices can now go back to work. Registration at the university has just started. During the negotiations in Bonn, they asked us to name an Uzbek delegation to join the interim government. Out of the six people, there is one lady [I named]. A group of women came to see me the other day wanting to get back to work. During our meeting, I asked them to immediately establish a council that could advise us on these issues and elect a representative who can become my deputy. I'll listen to their advice.
The burqa became a symbol of Taliban oppression to women. Even with the Taliban defeated, not all Afghan women are throwing off their burqas. Why?
They can choose to do what they want. I didn't force it, and I won't force them to take it off. It's their decision.
What about your wife -- does she wear the burqa?
My answer is the same whether it's my wife or any woman in Northern Afghanistan. This is my wife's own decision.
This war is against one of the most fundamentalist of regimes in recent history. Are you a secular man yourself?
This has been my position in the past. I have long been opposed to fundamentalism. I warned about the Taliban to all visiting delegations, including Americans. I used to tell them that one day, these people would be a big problem for all of us. Though alone and weak, I was consistently against fundamentalism and extremism. People cannot remain without democracy and freedoms and should have rights.
About the writer
Asla Aydintasbas is a New York journalist. Her writing has appeared in the Wall Street Journal, the International Herald Tribune, the New York Times and other publications.
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